YAKMAN: I did not go through all the posts in this thread so I do not know know if this question has been raised already but I need an answer from Sir Epi. What exactly is the “image and likeness” of God that we are meant to be? Are we to become as powerful as God or as knowledgeable and wise as God?
EMA: Thank you for this twin questions sir Yakman.
While I would invite you to read from the beginning of this thread so you can contribute inputs or raise some other questions which could lead us to more understanding and thereby grow with it, yes, your question has not been asked the way you do now.
My present understanding of “the ‘image and likeness’ of God that we are meant to be” is putting on God’s image which the bible says all in one word, love, and God’s nature which is being a spirit.
The image is the character or reputation which is love and the likeness is the nature which is spirit.
God is love, says John, and man needs to have love in order to know God for man to emulate and be conformed to.
1 John 4:8 He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.
And, unlike man who now is dust, God is spirit.
John 4:24 God is Spirit…
Yes, we are “to become as powerful as God or as knowledgeable and wise as God”. “We shall be like Him.”
1 John 3:2…we shall be like Him…
Admerald: Aside from Genesis 1:27 which confirms that man who has flesh was created in the image of God.
There are other passages of the Bible that confirms that man was created in the image of God. I would like EPI to give us his interpretation of this text and show to us how he can fit in his idea that to be in the image of God means to be spirit beings.
Genesis 9:6
Whoever sheds man’s blood, By man his blood shall be shed, For in the image of God He made man.
1 Corinthians 11:7
For a man ought not to have his head covered, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man.
YAKMAN: Agree with Adme. God is not reproducing himself as believed by Sir Epi. In reproduction cycle, the reproduced can challenge the reproducer which cannot be true in our relationship with God. God has already created man in his own image as told by the verses quoted by Adme.
EMA: When one takes all the bible verses together on the “image of God”, he will have the means to understand the import of it as the character of God rather than the physical features we see man has.
Just this simple question to both of you: Can’t God see you when you are at his back if he has two eyes like man which are placed in front of his head?
Admerald: What?
Do you picture God like that?
God is everywhere, whenever their is space, God is in there.
EMA: So what is that image you are talking about?
Admerald: difinitely not as what you are trying to push into.
for the Bible clearly says that we are created according to the image of God.
Genesis 1:27
Genesis 9:6
1 Corinthians 11:7
Refute those text, give me your alternative explanation and how your spirit being theory could be inserted on those text.
EMA: Ah, you prefer not to express your understanding of “image” of God that man is the exact physical feature of God whose eyes are in front of his face that he could not see you when you are at his back. What about the feathers and wings Adme?
The “image of God” in Genesis 1:27, 9:6 and 1 Corinthians 11:7 do not refer to man’s physical features. Otherwise, you’ll have problems like the one I cited which you refuse to answer.
When God created man from the dust of the ground (Genesis 1:27), the verse merely describes God’s finishing the physical phase in his creating man. It is finished as far as this stage is concerned.
When God showed Adam the tree of life, God was leading Adam to the second stage of creation, the spiritual character development, the “image of God”.
Genesis 9:6 shows how much man should be respected, that he should not be killed because of God’s special purpose for man to develop God’s character which is not offered to any other creature of God. Man is special compared with the other creatures.
Genesis 9:6 “Whoever sheds man’s blood,
By man his blood shall be shed;
For in the image of God
He made man.
The same explanation holds with 1 Corinthians 11:7.
The “image of God” is the character of God, which is set to always choose the right when confronted with making a choice between right and wrong, which is being developed in the man who undergoes the spiritual creation stage.
The temporary mortal stage will be gone when the final stage is reached which is when man is changed to spirit as God is spirit.
You’ll have a problem seeing my stand because you don’t believe John who says that man will become spirit as God is spirit.
Admerald: How could you say that is the way I understand the image of God? Of course Not!
You are not talking to a kid here. If you think God looks like that -then fine, but don’t accuse me of something I do not believe.
When we say the image of God, we are not talking about body anatomy here. that is simply childish.
I believe that the image of God pertains to his rationality and hollines, animals are not created in the image of God. So animals are not rational creatures and have no sense of morality, which man have. If you don’t agree with it- that is fine.
Genesis 1:27 says very clearly
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
It clearly says that God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him. Not partially!
You are trying squezed your tradition to the text.
Genesis 9:6 and 1 Cor 11:7 says
says that man is the image of God.
How could you insert the “developmental stage thing” on this passage? Nothing in there that suggest so, it’s only in your tradition, so you interpret that text in this way. Why not let the Bible speak?
Now, show me in John that says we will be spirit also as God is spirit and I’ll leave forum for good.
EMA: Admerald wrote:
How could you say that is the way I understand the image of God? Of course Not!
You are not talking to a kid here. If you think God looks like that -then fine, but don’t accuse me of something I do not believe.
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I’m not accusing Adme. Since after presenting my understanding of “image of God” you did not present yours, I just speculated what could have been yours based on your insistence that mine was erroneous.
As to biblical understanding, I don’t mind being labeled in the level of a kid. We sure are compared to the level of Jesus Christ who should be our standard (Ephesians 4:13).
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Admerald wrote:
When we say the image of God, we are not talking about body anatomy here. that is simply childish.
I believe that the image of God pertains to his rationality and hollines, animals are not created in the image of God. So animals are not rational creatures and have no sense of morality, which man have. If you don’t agree with it- that is fine.
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Now it is fine to me because you seem to be agreeing with me.
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Admerald wrote:
Genesis 1:27 says very clearly
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
It clearly says that God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him. Not partially!
You are trying squezed your tradition to the text.
Genesis 9:6 and 1 Cor 11:7 says
says that man is the image of God.
How could you insert the “developmental stage thing” on this passage? Nothing in there that suggest so, it’s only in your tradition, so you interpret that text in this way. Why not let the Bible speak?
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Understanding a bible teaching involves gathering the verses relating to it.
Since we are talking about creation, we do not read only the verses in Genesis. What about the “new creation” which Paul mentions?
2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.
This verse should lead one to reexamine his understanding and relate what Paul says with the creation verses in Genesis as well as the other relevant verses in the other books of the bible.
I have fully explained the creation process. It is there for you to reread if you care.
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Admerald wrote:
Now, show me in John that says we will be spirit also as God is spirit and I’ll leave forum for good.
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What a dare Adme. I surely would miss your views because your views help me in also reexamining my views which lead to more understanding.
John says that God is spirit and we will be like God and see God as he is.
John 4:24 God is Spirit…
1 John 3:2 Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.
Admerald: Epifanio M. Almeda wrote:
John 4:24 God is Spirit…
1 John 3:2 Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.
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Glad to know you will miss me EPI, I’m flatered
But Sorry, Im staying for a while
1 John 3:2 is being abused by many cults.
“we shall be like him”. Anybody without considering the entire scripture would come up with very rediculous idea. Such as we shall be like God, we will be God also, or we will acquire God like knowledge, or power or ability.
YOu can put all of what you can think of on this passage, that is if you ignore the teachings of the Scripture.
In Revelation 1:8, John describe the Lord as the Almighty who declares he is the Alpha and Omega.
Someone may argue and take 1 John 3:2 and say. SEE GUYS, we will be almighty also, we will be the Alpha and OMEGA also, for we will be like him.
WHich is of course absurd, simmilarly your understanding that we will be spirit like God is also faulty. Nothing less than those who claim that we will be the Almighty also someday.
EMA: You are voicing opinions and adding to what I explained Adme.
The issue is simply whether man will be in the likeness of God or be like God. Your missing this issue shows in your injecting into the discussion “Such as we shall be like God, we will be God also”. Then you criticize what you have introduced and assumed as my lines. Wake up Adme.
You don’t believe man will be like God because you simply don’t believe, not only John, but God himself.
Genesis 1:26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness…
To you God is not powerful enough to attain his objective. Now, who is ignoring the teaching of scripture?
Admerald: we are going in cycle here.
and Gensis 1:27 says:
So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.
Not Partial, not ongoing, he created them!
Period.
EMA: You must have meant “circle” and not “cycle”.
If you put a period to your understanding of creation at Genesis 1:27, it’s your call and it doesn’t bother me at all Adme.
I’ll just leave you with this thought to ponder on if you want. While “image” is mentioned twice in Genesis 1:27, it does not say God had created man according to his likeness.
Admerald: SO you want likeness?
Genesis 5:1
This is the written account of Adam’s line.
When God created man, he made him in the likeness of God.
read it again.
When God created man, he made him in the likeness of God
same hebrew word in Genesis 1:26. dĕmuwth
He made him in the likeness of God.
not processing, not ongoing, not partially, He made him in the likeness of God!
Period.
EMA: Look at the final product Adme. Can you describe God by looking at and touching yourself? Far from it.
I have stated that the past tenses used – “created” and “made” – refer to the first stage of creation. If there are no further stages after the physical, then God looks like you with his two eyes at the back of his head limiting his view. You likewise limited the likeness to God that man should become.